How To Deal With Your Stuff So Your Kids Don’t Have To with Eli Harwood

In this week's episode with my friend, Eli Harwood, we talk about how our unhealed wounds show up in parenting and how healing can change what our kids inherit. We share stories, practical repair language, and why self-compassion and community support matter more than getting everything right. 

• Monica’s story of divorce, absence, and later healing 
• Eli’s family experience with mental health support and growth 
• why it’s never too late to deal with your emotional baggage 
• cycle breaking through small choices and showing up differently 
• repair as the difference between hurt and long-term harm 
• perfectionism as a hidden source of pressure in parent-child bonds 
• using self-compassion instead of shame to create change 
• why kids need other trusted adults and a wider support system 
• how the book’s chapters match real emotions like anxiety and regret 
• trusting your intuition and trusting your kids 

Go grab Eli's new book: How to Deal with Your Stuff So Your Kids Don't Have To on Amazon or anywhere books are sold.

Transcript

Welcome And Why This Matters

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Hello and welcome to the Secrets of Happily Ever After podcast. I'm your host, Monica Tanner, and I have such a treat for you today. I am sitting with my friend Eli Harwood, who is a licensed therapist and the creator of Attachment Nerd, but I know her as a parenting expert and somebody who has put so much love and effort into helping parents really manage their own stuff so that their kids don't have to deal with it. And I am so, so, so excited to have her here with me to discuss her new book, How to Deal with Your Stuff. So your kids don't have to. Such an important topic. Eli, thank you so much for joining me today. How are you?

SPEAKER_01 0:46

I'm good. It's so good to see you as always.

SPEAKER_00 0:49

Yes. Yes, yes, yes. You just have my heart. Your work is so important. And as the mom of four kids and somebody who I feel like really has had a lot of experience with having to having stuff. Having stuff. We all have stuff, right? We all nobody gets to come here and not have stuff.

SPEAKER_01 1:09

No, that's not a thing. And if someone tells you that, they're they're probably starting a cult and you should run.

SPEAKER_00 1:16

Yes. I guess I have like just such personal experience with a mom who had stuff and who dealt with her stuff in a very inconvenient time for me, I think. But I'm so, so, so grateful that she did. It was such a gift for me that I feel like it's such a gift. No matter when you deal with your stuff, it is the best gift you can give your kids.

SPEAKER_01 1:43

Well, now I want to know the story. How old were you? What was inconvenient? What triggered her to just say, okay, I need to do some work on my emotional baggage? What was

A Divorce And A Long Absence

SPEAKER_01 1:52

that?

SPEAKER_00 1:52

Yeah. Well, my story is when I was 12 years old, my parents divorced. And I think that was a huge trigger to my mom. Of like she had stuff. And so my mom left the state we were living in to deal with her stuff. So we I was born and raised in Texas after my parents divorced. She moved to Oregon. Okay. For five years. And I was 12 years old. So she missed like me going through puberty and my prom and you know, all of the teenage big stuff. Yeah. And my dad was wonderful, and he remarried a woman who had her own stuff and and had two daughters. And so, you know, it wasn't really available for me. And so I feel like my teenage years was a a lot of me handling myself on my own. Yeah. Like really having to make my own way. Now I will tell you what a beautiful gift that my mom went to Oregon and learned how to love herself because that was generational, it was handed down through the generations. My mom didn't know what love really looked like. And so, you know, I feel like I did okay for myself. I went to college, I got good grades. One of the things I learned through this, my adaptations was I felt like I had to earn love. There wasn't enough love, and I had to be perfect and I had to perform really well in order to get love. And so I got married and I had a bunch of children, and I got to this like real crossroads in my own life where I had from the outside a beautiful life. I had three small children. My husband was super successful. We had a really nice home. And I didn't feel like I deserved any of it. And I was about to just crash, burn the whole thing down to the ground. I got really, really anxious. So anxious that I couldn't take care of myself or my children. Oh, oh, oh, oh. And my husband didn't really know what to do with me. So he called my mom and said, I don't know what to do. And she said, send her to me. And so he did. My husband sent me home. And in a few days, my mom knew the wounding that she had passed down to me. And in a few days, was able to pass the healing down to me. Wow. And I feel like in a very short amount of time, my mom helped me heal so much of what I needed, of what that little girl, that little 12-year-old needed from my mom that she wasn't there for. But she was able to give me what I needed as a 29-year-old woman.

SPEAKER_01 4:33

As a mom struggling in motherhood under the immense emotional turmoil that can come with being a mom.

SPEAKER_00 4:40

Absolutely. Absolutely. And she sent me home to my family. And I was like, okay, I know I need to ask for help. I know I can't do this on my own. I know that I can't perfect my way through this. And not only did my mom hand down so much healing to me, but she also offered like ongoing support. My mom comes to visit all the time. She's wonderful, grandma. She's a wonderful caring mother. She learned what love was and in such a poignant point of my life, taught me that I didn't, there was no love to be earned. I just was love.

SPEAKER_01 5:16

And I was deserving of it.

Making Repair Possible Later

SPEAKER_01 5:20

What a powerful story. And I think a very rare story in the sense that your mom really like checked out of her role with you at a very tender stage of your life. And I mean, I don't know if you would use the word abandonment, but there was like some abandonment there. Abandonment issues, of course. Yes. Yeah. And yet she was able to understand that she did that to you and understand what that impact was and then show up for you at a later stage. And I think that's such an important message for parents to hear, even on a micro level, of like there are moments in our story where we don't show up for our kids, where our wounds take over and they make it hard for us to be the parent that our kids need us to be. And that we can still figure out how to be that parent later. And it isn't by beating ourselves up because we weren't there and how terrible we were. It's having an incredible amount of self-compassion so that we can then have that same compassion for our kids. I mean, that's pretty magical.

Eli’s Family Turning Point

SPEAKER_01 6:19

My my story is different in that my mom left for a week when I was nine years old and she checked herself into a psychiatric hospital. But it's so there's some parallels there because she was in the throes of raising kids and was like not okay. But where the where the similarities meet is that she went to this hospital and all these people were like helping her and supporting her. And she was like, Oh my gosh, when I feel supported, I'm okay. It's like her brain was like, Oh, the problem is I'm isolated. Yeah. And then she really paved a path forward of just a life of growth and learning and doing what you can. And for her, that was like getting on medications. She got diagnosed with depression and was struggling with, you know, mood dysregulation around all that stuff, getting into therapy, changing who she was around. In her story, that meant eventually divorcing my dad, who was not someone who was ever gonna grow or change and give her what she needed. So I think it's just really important for everyone to remember that it's never too late to start dealing

It’s Never Too Late

SPEAKER_01 7:20

with your stuff. It's never too late.

SPEAKER_00 7:22

I love what you just said because I've had such an enjoyable time reading this book because there's so much, there's just so much good and value in this. But if you don't even open the book, the title literally is the gift. It is the gift because I feel like I had the opportunity to do a lot of this when my kids were young. My mom did it when I was a teenager. And I've seen people do it in their adulthood when their kids are adults. It doesn't matter when you do this. Doing this is the gift to your children. Yes, and yourself.

SPEAKER_01 7:59

And yourself. You know, my publisher thought this is a very long title. So I I had to be like, well, what I really, really wanted was the title to be How to Deal with Your Blank So Your Kids Don't Have To Asterisk as Much. Yes, that's right, right. They did give me the asterisk and the as much is on the back of the cover. But that was really important to me because of course our kids are always gonna be dealing with our stuff to some degree. Right. But or it'll be different. We lessen that. You know, it's like the goal, the goal is to lessen the amount of emotional baggage our kids inherit from. Right. And they're gonna inherit some. And God bless them, they need that to have a meaningful cycle breaking experience themselves. Exactly. Right. Like every kid deserves to do a little bit better than their parents did when they're raising their own kids, if they so choose to raise them. Right, right, right, right. But we can do things that change their level of load, you know, and that's that's the goal. Just lighten it, even if it's a little bit, even if it's when they're teens, even if it's when they're 40. My grandma gave me this really incredible gift at the very, very end of her life. And she didn't give it to my mom. I wish she had been able to give it to my mom. But we were at her uh nursing home, and my mom's friend was visiting. And she had got she had started to have a little dementia at this point, but she looked over at my mom's friend and she looked over at me and then she said to her her friend, her name's Heller. She said to Heller, she goes, Have you seen her parent? And my grandma has not talked about my parenting, she has not complimented my parenting. She was always annoyed with kids around. Kids are annoying, they're too loud. And then Heller said, Oh, I have. And she, and then my grandma goes, She's having so much more fun than we did. And it was so sweet and innocent. And I thought, oh my gosh, thank you. Like, thank you. Because the gift was her inner child understood what I was doing with my kids was right. She understood it. She could never, her pride, her shame, her stuff was always in the way of her being able to just be free and enjoy it. She was never able to say to my mom or to me, I wish I had done this differently. You know, that would have been incredible if she could have said, Hey, I wish I had been more free with you or more playful with you or less critical of you. Honestly, she was critical of my mom till the day she died, my poor mom. As my mom is literally taking care of her.

SPEAKER_00 10:13

I think my mom and my grandma had that same exact relationship. It's really interesting.

SPEAKER_01 10:18

We we we really seem to fall on the same part of the cycle breaking tree, I think. Yeah, yeah. But you know, that it was weeks before she died, and that was still not too late. Like that was still a gift to me to have her just acknowledge in the smallest way that, you know, she left a lot of heaviness and harshness around all of us. So I I don't know, that maybe that's the core message I want everyone to hear on this particular conversation is start now.

SPEAKER_00 10:43

Yeah. It's never too late. You know, it's cool because I always say, you're gonna wound your kids. Like that's the point. You but you may but you may not wound them in the same way you were wounded, right? Like that's what's really cool is that cycle breaking opportunity

Breaking Cycles In Real Life

SPEAKER_00 11:00

that we all have. So here's a cool story. So my 17-year-old has prom this weekend. Okay. And originally my husband and I had a trip planned because we didn't know the date. And so when I found out it was my daughter's prom, my mom missed all my proms. She wasn't there to help me get ready, right? And so when I found out when her prom was and that we were gonna be gone, I was like, not gonna be gone. Move the trip. And we took a financial hickey, right? Like moving the flights, moving the hotel room, moving the rental car. It cost a significant amount of money. And I was so grateful that A, we could handle that additional cost. Two, that my husband knows me well enough that he knew how important it was for me to be there for my daughter's prom. That he knew that I was not gonna be happy sitting on a beach somewhere while my daughter was getting ready for prom without me. Like it just wasn't gonna work out, right? Yep. Yes. And so he handled. My husband doesn't do like spending ridiculous money for nothing well. But he knew that that was important to me, right? I love that. And so I always know that my kids are gonna be wounded in some way, shape, or form, but not in the same way that I was wounded. And because my mom was there for me when I needed her most, I also have the hope that at some point when my kids have to face their wounding, yes, I will be there to help them. Because I've done this, what you talked about in this book. Yes. So here's the other thing to note.

Repair Beats Perfectionism

SPEAKER_01 12:36

Yes, we will all hurt our kids throughout the process. That is, but there's a difference between a hurt that gets addressed and gets medical care quickly and a hurt that is left open and exposed to bacteria and you know, long-term infections. And so I think the the difference between kids who have secure experiences with their caregivers and kids who don't is not the absence of hard stuff. It's the presence of repair around that stuff. You know, so it's the difference between I'm I'm being harsh and short with my kids and I'm exhausted and I'm whatever. And but I'm able then to recognize that and say, hey, I'm so sorry you didn't deserve that. I'm dealing with some work stress and that wasn't on you. That, you know, you're you're putting some antibiotic cream on that wound. And so that's a different experience. Um, so I think that's really important. Actually, one of the chapters in the book is how to deal with the perfectionism habit, because I think so many people, and this can be true for me as well, when you have had insecurity in your childhood and you've had capital W wounds that did not get cared for and did get infected, then there's this pressure of like, I don't want my kid to have that, I don't want my kid to have that. And that actually becomes itself the wound because there's this pressure in the relationship instead of an acceptance of, you know, we're messy, we're emotional creatures. We don't stop being emotional creatures at any point in our journey. And so we can't expect ourselves to be perfect, and it's not helpful for our kids if we do. Um, it's much more helpful that we become people who can say, oops, I don't like the way I just handled that. Oh, I'm noticing that I've been distracted for a season of our relationship. And I don't, I'm really gonna course correct on that. So, you know, let me know if you're noticing something that is distracting in me and that is getting in the way of you and I and things you need from me.

SPEAKER_00 14:34

Yeah, I love that idea of I I just did a whole podcast series, like you're literally the end of it, right? Is spring doing a relationship reset, right? Like it's we're gonna make mistakes, we're gonna get off course. Like you said, we're gonna be distracted with this or that or the other. We might forget what our values are at times, right? But it's not nothing has gone wrong and we don't have to burn it all down to the ground. It's like, let's course correct. Yes. How do we take inventory of where we're at? What we need to do to fix it. And and it's all okay.

SPEAKER_01 15:07

I saw a very funny Instagram world the other day, and it was this woman basically kind of saying so that what she would do is she'd take lipstick on and she'd get it a little bit off on her lip, and she'd go, Oh, well, I already ruined it, why bother? And then she'd like run the lipstick up her face, or she'd put her deodorant on, and then she'd get a little on her shirt and she'd be like, ah, it doesn't matter. And she'd rub it all over her shirt. And the whole point of the video was like, of course, it like just because you made a mistake doesn't mean you have to go further, right? It doesn't mean you have to dig your heels into that or give up. You can stop, wipe off the part you missed, and get back on track to where you want it to actually go. That I think is so important with parenting is yeah, we're gonna mess up, we're gonna be human, and we can be the type of parents who deal with our stuff. We can't give our kids perfect parents, but we can give our kids parents who take accountability for their emotional baggage and work on it.

SPEAKER_00 15:58

Yeah.

Why The Book Is Structured

SPEAKER_00 15:59

That's one of the things I really appreciate about this book is just how you formatted it. These are all things that as humans we feel anxious, lonely, tired, shame, regret. Like each chapter is like, hey, human. Yes, yes. Are you experiencing this thing? Here, here's what's normal about it. Here's how it might affect your children. Here's how to get back on track if you find yourself kind of going down that path. It just offers a lot of hope, I thought.

SPEAKER_01 16:32

Like I was just like, Oh, good.

SPEAKER_00 16:34

Yes, yes.

SPEAKER_01 16:35

No, I want that because we can't we can't deal with things from a catastrophic place. And when I was writing this book, I was thinking of several things. One, I was thinking of what are the things I feel like I still need to work on. So I always write books for myself because why, why not? I need a lot of things. So I might as well focus on the things I'm working on. The second thing I work on is the things that I've seen in my clinical practice over the last 19 years. You know, there's what are the things that I've seen get in between parents and kids that parents really didn't understand that were that was like confusing for the parent. And the kid is like, no, this is what I'm trying to say to you. And then the research. And then what does the research say? Matters and what do we need to deal with? And at the end of the day, what we're trying to do is become emotionally reliable for our kids. Yes.

SPEAKER_00 17:17

The other thing I love about this book is you give those additional resources, like the end of each chapter. So let's say I deal with anxiety. That's probably my biggest kind of thing. At the end, you give additional resources. So I really want to dig in. You know, you gave me like a really great template to recognize, okay, I'm feeling anxiety. Here's further reading. Like, here's the research, here's like the the really good, understandable way to get into this for myself.

SPEAKER_01 17:47

Well, because I think the average person who's going to pick up this book, there'll be three or four things that you're like, no, I don't deal with those. Those are not, that's not my stuff. That's not my stuff. And you can cheer and have a little moment of celebration for that and maybe just never read those chapters. Or you might read them because you're like, that's my partner's stuff, or that's my sibling's stuff. Much easier to see everyone else's stuff. I know, I know. And then there will be a few things that you're very clearly like, okay, I know for sure these are my things. And as you're reading those, you you might feel like, okay, this is actually a place I need to really focus. So I wanted there to be like, okay, now I can go deeper with these resources that, like, you know, this is an entire book on this topic. Then the other things, you know, you might read them and think, well, I don't know. And and then you might actually go through and read it and go, oh my. Oh my, this is my stuff. And then so I really wanted there to be other places to dig deeper as well. There's also self-compassion scripts in every chapter. Yes, I like those. Because again, shame does not serve us as parents, beating ourselves up about the places that we need growth does not help us grow. It makes us feel terrible. So the goal is to be able to go, here's why I am where I am, and this is what it looks like to move forward. And here's how I can mature.

SPEAKER_00 18:59

I love that.

Asking For Help And Building Community

SPEAKER_00 19:00

Another thing I really noticed in here, and probably this sticks out to me because it's my stuff, but my adaptation, like the thing that I got from my whole childhood growing up, was I can't depend on anybody else, right? Nobody's gonna, nobody's gonna be there for me. I I gotta figure it out, right?

SPEAKER_01 19:17

Yeah, well, that and that would what a brilliant adaptation that is when your mom pieces out at 12 years old. Right. And that was that was a brilliant way to cope at that time.

SPEAKER_00 19:25

Exactly. But that was not serving me as a mother of three young children with a business and a household, and like didn't know what the crap I was doing. Yes. And so what what I learned, what my mom helped me understand is that it's okay to ask for help. It's okay. And I feel like you say that in multiple, multiple chapters. Oh, I mean a friend, get some support, ask somebody, right?

SPEAKER_01 19:49

Like my advantage was like, I mean, I think you're giving this advice like on repeat. And I'm like, yeah, because people need to hear that on repeat. Because I'm not just talking to someone, I'm talking to their inner child. The message is yeah, it's normal to depend. We are wired for attachment, we are wired for community. We are not supposed to be raising kids by ourselves.

unknown 20:14

Right.

SPEAKER_01 20:14

I I mean, I I'm not, I don't have a solution for this, but ideally, we would somehow be back into a human rhythm of true villages where, you know, you dine together and you have bedtime at the same time. You know, this starts getting into like cult territory. And I'm the second time I've mentioned cults, but you know, you have to you have to be careful about how you join community, of course. However, we really are not wired to be alone with our kids all day. And our kids aren't wired to be alone with us all day.

SPEAKER_00 20:45

And I don't think it's possible for us to give our kids everything that they need. This is one thing. So agreed, right? Like my my whole like hill that I'll die on. I love to call your hills that you'll die on, right? My hill that I'll die on is there have to be other adults your kids can depend on. Agreed. Like there will always be at some point a time when a neighbor, a friend, an aunt, somebody can give provide something for your child that you just can't in that moment.

SPEAKER_01 21:16

Yep. And whether that's because your kid is an adolescent and they just think you are lame and unknowledgeable and they want someone else who knows more. Or, you know, we aren't all none of none of us are matched perfectly with all of our kids, meaning, you know, they're wired differently. They have different interests than we do. There, there's a there's a developmental experience for them that you've never had because they're growing up in a different generation than you did. So having people who I can meet them in those places that differently than you is huge.

unknown 21:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 21:49

I love that. Yeah. And that's my whole like one week a year, you and your spouse should take a trip. Go somewhere and allow your kids to depend on other adults.

SPEAKER_01 22:00

I love that. Absolutely. If you can, obviously. There's so much. You know, anytime we have conversations about parenting, I'm very aware of privilege and how privilege affects parenting. And, you know, in an ideal world, everyone would have the social infrastructure to be able to take care of themselves and their kids in all of the ways that we talk about. And I know not everyone does. So if you don't have that, you know, let's say you're a single parent, you don't have a partner. So not only is there no once a week, I mean once a year, one week a year. Yes, yes, yes. But then there's no partner at all. And so there, if that's if that's the case, you know, that might be meaning that you take a couple of days a year to go be by yourself while, you know, someone is with your kids. And that might not be something that can happen until they're older. And like, you know, there's a lot of nuances, but when you can take care of yourself, please do.

SPEAKER_00 22:55

Yeah, I am aware that I am I have this amazing village, and I'm so lucky that I get to raise my kids here. It's like a small-ish town, you know, and I always like joke. I'm like, you're not gonna be able to get into too much trouble. Someone will recognize you.

SPEAKER_01 23:12

That's so great.

SPEAKER_00 23:13

That's really cute. So just be aware of that. That's really cute. Oh, goodness.

Core Parenting Advice From The Heart

SPEAKER_00 23:21

Well, Eli, this is so fun. What is your I I love bad marriage advice, and so obviously I love good advice. Like, what's your advice to parents? Like, what from your heart, like all of this work that you've done and all of this experience that you have, like what would you tell a mama or or a father who is just like struggling with, like, I don't know what I'm doing?

SPEAKER_01 23:45

The the building blocks for relationship are inside of you. You are wired to have a positive relationship with your kids. And you may have to unlearn some things that you learn to adapt in your own childhood, but it's in you. And that instinct in you to take care of them, focus it on having a positive relationship with them. And you do that by having a positive relationship with yourself and your emotions. And so that's that's what I this I kind of see this book as like a paper parent on the shelf. Like if you didn't have that parent growing up who could model those things, you can like be in an emotional moment and feel lost and feel overwhelmed and pull it off the shelf and be like, wait, okay, what am I, what am I feeling right now? Oh, I'm feeling reeling a sense of regret and I don't know what to do. That's making me anxious. Okay, I'm gonna read those two chapters. Or, oh, I'm feeling rejected by my kids. Oh, this is my old compulsion to numb out, and I need to sort of think about that, or you know, I've got some shame, or I'm being perfectionist. I mean, there's 32 topics in the book. But so it's like you can read it when you need it, and that's my hope. My hope is that it kind of offers you a sense of reassurance and guidance that maybe your own childhood didn't have to give you, and that it will make it a little bit easier for your kids to inherit that experience from you so they can give the, you know, just generationally it can pass forward. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 25:03

Okay, I love that. And I agree because the chapters are laid out just exactly like that. You're like, I'm feeling regret.

SPEAKER_02 25:09

Cool.

SPEAKER_00 25:09

Read that chapter. Like, read it

Fear Of Mistakes Comes From Childhood

SPEAKER_00 25:11

when you need it. That sound has a great ring to it. What would you say to the parent who's like, I'm so afraid of making a mistake?

SPEAKER_01 25:18

I'm gonna screw this up. I would say there's a little person inside of you who got either blamed or humiliated or left alone in their mistakes. And that terror, that level of terror that you have about making mistakes, that is something that actually doesn't belong in parenthood. That's something that's from childhood. And your job is to go back to that younger part of you and say, you know what? You're gonna make it out, and you're gonna make it out just fine. And you're gonna have kids who love you and who you love, and it's gonna no longer feel so dangerous to make mistakes. And mistakes are part of the gig. They're just part of the gig. Nobody's not making them. That's not a thing. I know that was a simple negative. My English teacher just said that was a mistake. And I said, Yes, English teacher, it was, and we can make them.

SPEAKER_00 26:02

I love that nobody's not making them, and that's the cool thing about kids. I mean, I have four of them, and I feel like I've been through the ringer with all of them, and they're very willing to give you love. You can make a lot of mistakes. Yeah, you can make a lot of mistakes with kids and they're still gonna love you. Yes.

SPEAKER_01 26:20

Yeah, I mean, love covers a multitude of mistakes. It does. And so if if you're feeling terrified of making a mistake, your job is to be like, okay, the volume on this is too loud, it's childhood stuff. And I need to, I actually need to get more comfortable with my mistakes because that will help me put some antibiotic on the wounds I create with my kids. Because if I'm terrified of making mistakes, then I'm gonna be terrified of admitting mistakes and I'm gonna be terrified of repairing mistakes. And those are the things my kids actually need. They don't need me to be free of mistakes, they need to be comfortable with taking care of them.

SPEAKER_00 26:56

So I'm gonna work on that. Yeah, me making mistakes gives my kids permission to make mistakes. Yep. And me living my best life gives my kids permission to live their best life.

SPEAKER_01 27:08

Yep. And you having self-compassion and understanding for your need to grow helps them have those same things. Beautiful.

SPEAKER_00 27:18

I love it. Okay,

Trust Yourself And Your Kids

SPEAKER_00 27:20

one last thing. What do you want readers to get from this?

SPEAKER_01 27:26

I want readers to have a clear sense of how to learn to love their emotional needs, how to respond to them, and then the reassurance that you've already been doing a lot of this. I want people to pick up this book and feel like they get some answers to the questions that they have and some reassurance that they've actually had a lot of knowledge in themselves already.

SPEAKER_02 27:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 27:49

You you want people to trust themselves, trust their own intuition. Absolutely. And their kids, and your kids. I want you to trust your kids too. That's so cool.

SPEAKER_00 28:02

Eli, thanks for your time. I just love you. I would keep you here all day and night.

SPEAKER_01 28:08

So good to be with you. So good to be with you too.

Where To Find Eli And The Book

SPEAKER_01 28:11

Everybody that if you want to, I run my mouth for free on the internet. So you can find me at attachment nerd on Instagram and Facebook mostly. And then um, there's like YouTube and some other ones I don't focus on as much. I have a podcast myself called the How to Deal Podcast. So if you want to listen for free and you can snag the book wherever you buy books or head to attachmentnerd.com and my other books are there too.

SPEAKER_00 28:33

I love it. I love it. Attachmentnerd.com. I imagine that goes out to everything. And go find her on Instagram because she is so fun on Instagram.

SPEAKER_01 28:42

Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 28:43

Thanks for coming.

SPEAKER_01 28:44

So good to be with you.